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Scientology Googlebomb  (View post)

/pd [PersonRank 10]

Tuesday, January 29, 2008
6 years ago11,652 views

Be very wary of the 10th of February and project chanology!!

www.partyvan.info/index.php/Project_Chanology

Jason Adams [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

A lot of people do link to scientology and refer to it as a cult. I think this is an inadvertent Googlebomb, rather than an intentional one, though. There are just a lot of people who think it's a cult. Very amusing.

Ionut Alex. Chitu [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

google.com/search?q=allinancho ...

Brock [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

This is not a Googlebomb. This is just Search doing what it does. Even if Scientology doesn't call itself a cult, that's what it is. It would be like if the search term "sexy hunk" went to Brad Pitt's homepage, even if he never used those words to describe himself.

This is called "revealed information." People's opinions are revealed the words they use to link to things.

scjm [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Matt Cutts is "head of webspam"?

Andrew Taylor [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

I agree with Brock, except about Brad Pitt.

Philipp Lenssen [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Scjm, well, perhaps more correctly "head of Google's Webspam team", to quote www.mattcutts.com. Shouldn't that be "anti-webspam team" though? :)

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here] Jason Adams, Brock, Andrew Tayler

This was entirely deliberate. Anonymous was behind it.

digg.com/world_news/Anonymous_ ...

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

digg.com/world_news/Anonymous_ ...

Anon [PersonRank 7]

6 years ago #

Brock is wrong. "Dangerous Cult" is indeed an organized Googlebomb effort.

Aegist [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

That is awesome.

Johnonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

They are dangerous, their propaganda, and censorship of their own material has labeled them unfit to be a part of a human society and as such it has been taken upon by the many to destroy this brainwashing, murdering, lying, pyramid scheme of a cult.

Tom Cruise [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Johnonymous is right...we are a bunch of whack jobd and need to be stopped at all costs... Um...I mean XENU!!!!

JMK [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

heres a website about what they are doing

partyvan.info/index.php/Projec ...

intheknow [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Scientology is based on the worship of Satan. Could that have anything to do with them getting a googlebomb? Maybe the details of the Googlebombing?

Is this googlbombing like the IEDs used by terrorists?

Zim [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

I think here is where PersonRank becomes handy, uh?
Andrew Taylor [PR 0] agreeing with Brock [PR 0] equals... zero as well.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here] intheknow-- wrong. scientology is not satanism.

Anonymous Supporter [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

I support Anonymous in their efforts against Scientology.

Not Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #


You guys are making baby Xenu cry.

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Scientology is a religion so Google should fix the "dangeroous cult" problem. If one wants to fiind what is Scientology he/she should read the book "What is Scientology" or "Fondaments of Thought". or "New slant on life".
To understand a subject one should read the original texts of that subject.
FG

Dominic Parker [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Interestingly enough, the Scientology homepage also ranks 23rd for the single ST 'cult'. That term obviously doesn't appear anywhere on their site.

What's the different between a Googlebomb and a lot of people linking to somewhere with what they feel is an accurate description of the target, even if its quite derogatory?

Philipp Lenssen [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Good question Dominic... I suppose that's one of the threshold things Google has to tackle when trying to defuse Googlebombs (how many links use the same link text, in what time frame did they appear, are sites linking to the target site perhaps usually of a different network etc.). Maybe specific Googlebombs might even try build on words for which the site already has OK rankings, to then do the final push to the #1 for that site using some more bomb campaign links...

waan [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

you guy s are making new scient ?

Anonymouse [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Q: What is a cult?
A: google.com/search?hl=en&de ...

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

i think that google should only link to Scientology.org if one types the word : Scientology or Religion, or the keywords found in the "heading" of the HTM document in the index page of the site.

In this way the search would be proper.

Alos if a site is providing false data on Scientology it should not appear in a list of sites when one is looking for the word Scientology.

For example a site is saying that Scientology believes in the god XYZ while it doesn't Google should mark off this site. In this way one would only find correct data on Scientology.

I think it is a good idea.

Anonymouse [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Google should link to a site based on how thoughts about something is expressed on the web. Not on how the one the search result points to would like it.

E.g. any company would like to see itself associated with positive terms like "best price", "best service". How the company thinks about itself is however not of interest for most people doing a search on best prices or best service; they want to see the result based on how is thought about companies.

This is no different for cults or relegions.

Wereas Google Bombs can be considered as sabotage of the search system, the opposite – just using the terms in which a company, a cult, religion or person want to describe itself – would be just as bad.

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Thanks for the reply.

The problem that I think should be solved is to take off the web those sites that are just full of lies.

Lets say that in my website I write that Scientology gave me the best answers I could find related to the mind and spirit.

That would be an onest statement.

One clicks on my site and find my opinion on Scientology.

But lets say that a suppressive person writes that:
Scientologist drink blood or
Scientologist believe in the god Xenu or
Scientologist worship Satan

All the above would be and are false data and the sites providing those data should give correct informations or be taken off the web.

This way a person looking for the word "Scientology" would find only correct data.

PS: I am a Scientologist since 1983 I have never read or heard the word Xenu so Who is stating that Scientologist believe in the god Xenu is a .... (you add the word).

PS 2 Again, IF one wants to find what is Scientology he should read the book "What is Scientology" also I really like the "Scientology Manual" that provides a lot of useful tools one can use to improve his life.

/pd [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

"The problem that I think should be solved is to take off the web those sites that are just full of lies."

What about my freedom of speech ?? what you think is lies , may not be lies to others ??

"This way a person looking for the word "Scientology" would find only correct data."

What is correct data ?? can you describe ??

/pd [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

..and just an FYI.. I have been tracking this darn story long before it reached A-lister's and the MSM are still not clued in fully..

twitter.com/peterdawson/status ...

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG and everyone else

The internet is raw information, it's impossible to censor or filter as whole and thats a good thing.

What a person chooses to accept ast the truth differs but may be reflected by the collective Mind of the internet.

If scientology ranks high with the searchterm "cult" (wich it does; see note below) it is the reflected opinion of the majority of pages listed in google using the word cult.

It doesn't matter if you, scientology or google dislikes the results;
it is the truth accepted by the collective.

Does Scientology has the right to manipulate the truth?
No one has the right to do so, but the collective has the power to.

We are Anonymous.
We are Legion.
We do not forgive.
We do not forget.
Expect us

(*Note: Cult was _not_ google bombed and CoS ranks pretty high)

David Mulder [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

I just want to say that, google should not be about what is correct, as that is relative, but about what most people think. So all I can say is that scientologist fg, is talking nonsense, by using the word lie in association with social relative statements. PS. on the dutch localized version of google one gets mediafire.com/?1nigyffbas8 up quite high for example should such a document then dissapear?

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here] SCIENTOLOGIST FG

The bottom line is that there is a lot more on the internet about what wrong with the Church of Scientology. The beliefs alone are harmless, but there are serious problem with the institution of the church. Censorship is not the answer. That's exactly why Anonymous is standing up to the church. Anonymous acts anonymously because those who don't are open to attack from the church. Anonymous is doing what must be done because only Anonymous can do it. Anonymous does not operate with an agenda. In the case of Scientology, Anon is united on something they happen to have a common belief in as a group of individuals-- so Anonymous unites under a common cause. Anonymous has no central command. They are all individuals, and they're all sick of Scientology (along with most of the Internet)

anon supporter [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

scientologists actually may have good morals and ethics though not especially rational. However the people at the top of hierarchy are all wicked money laundering fanatics.... just like most of our political representatives. so i'm glad some brave entity is doing something against this corrupt organization.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Dugg: digg.com/world_news/Scientolog ...

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Anon,
The first thing to find a rational answer is to look at the data you have and take off the false data in it.
After that you can have a valid conclusion.
If you operate with false data, than, indipendently of the "way" you think you get wrong answers.
For example... what is the source of the datum "wicked money laundering fanatics".... Have you seen a top Scientology executive going around with a "Ferrari Testa Rossa" and buying villas around the world?

Is the source of your informations providing raw and factual data? ... or is HE the real "fanatic" interested only in "money"?

See, 70 years ago in Germany there were wicked campains agains jewes. All the propaganda was just "false data" and we know what happened after.

So... accepting and forwarding false data will only bring problems and you should help to decrease the transmission of false data and help to forward correct data and help to create a world based on understanding.

If you want to know what Scientology believes in read a book like "What is Scientology". ... it is a big book with a lot of data... That is what Scientologist believe in....

If you THEN find these data useful and valid and you want to support it, it is your decision but if you just operate with opinions, based on opinions, based on false data spread around by some person that has something to hide than you will have a problem....

FG

/pd [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

"What is Scientology". ... it is a big book with a lot of data... That is what Scientologist believe in...."

Wrong, its a book with a lot of opinion!!

Data is based on empirical facts. For e.g. A Buddhist believes in Buddha because at some point of time, Buddha Existed (its Historical fact).

From a book called as "dianetics" – by Ron Hubbard

"There's a hidden enemy woking against you, [..] its called as a the reactive mind"

The second our minds react to something that is fundamentally not 'favarouble" to CoS, Dianetics has to be triggered by CoS members. That is, called as the "law of returning" within CoS.

This, In my (not so) Humble Opinion, is a bunch of crock . It limits the person's ability to question and think for themselves. This was brought to light during the latest Jan15 leaked video of T.C – who behave's so much like a lunatic!!

btw.. for those interested really interested in knowing more about "cults"
then read up here

factnet.org/rancho5.htm

and with this.. me is signing out from tis thread.

..nuff said – take it with a grain of salt- so as they say :)-

Yuck [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Comparing criticism of the CoS to the Holocaust – both misleading and highly distasteful. You lose!

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear pd,

Evidently you have not read the book and not having the correct data on Scientology you are against what you things scientology is rather than what Scientology really is.

Have you read the "goals of Scientology"? Have you read the "Axioms"? Have you read the book "Fondaments of thought"? or "A new slant on life"?.

There you can find what Scientology is.

If you read them and than you would say "I don't think that so and so is correct" I can understand that.... but if you say that "Scientologist are Satanists" or "Scientologist drink blood" etc etc... than you will have a problem as thank you are spreading lies and that is againt the law.....

FG

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG

Comparing Holocaust to CoS Critism is rather distasteful and not very fitting.
I could very well compare CoS and it's handling of critics with Holocaust but I wouldn't do that, not because I'm afraid, ethics are there for a reason you know?

Only because you're a scientologiest and did not hear about it does not make the things Anonymous tells untrue.
May I ask you on what level you are, assuming you're allowed to speak on that matter.
It's a fact that you get access to more documents of scientology while you raise in ranks (while also spending more money to do so).
Farther assuming you're not a millionaire it's very possible there are many things you haven't heard of.

Also that statement from "intheknow" about Scientology beeing based on satansim may come from the fact the founder of Scientology, L .Ron Hubbard was indeed in some point of his life an active satanist, he was in the infamous group of Aleistair Crowley.
You can look it up if you don't believe me (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Ron_H ...)

We are Anonymous.
We are Legion.
We do not forgive.
We do not forget.
Expect us on the 10th of Februar, worldwide.

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Sorry messed up the link use en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Ron_H ... instead of the messed up one above.

/pd [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Ok I have to address the last comments which were directed to me....

... (I promise tis the last!!)

Ok, I Read Ron Hubbards Book title "Dianetics" , which was written nearly in 1950 and that forms the base for CoS Philosophies and I don't think it is correct and true! PERIOD.

So, therefore, I seek you understanding of MY above comments based on your statement

==>"If you read them and than you would say "I don't think that so and so is correct" I can understand that

As a last rebuttal point ..

"Dianetics has been highly controversial since its introduction. The scientific community has never recognized Hubbard's "Modern Science of Mental Health" as a valid scientific theory, and it has repeatedly been dismissed in print as pseudoscience. Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science by Martin Gardner includes an entire chapter on the subject as pseudoscience."

Another one of f Hubbard's essay's is "Terra Incognita: The Mind" – which come out in the The Explorers Journal, winter 1949 / spring 1950 (on the bridge between cybernetics and general semantics)!!

Read it- its time well wasted , you will get a glimpse of the root Thesis of CoS

anon [PersonRank 7]

6 years ago #

[personal attack removed]

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear pd and anonimous,

Ron Hubbard has given about 3,000 lectures and has written dozens of books on Dianetics and Scientology.

This includes also a series of books on organization and set of books called techical bulletins that deal with all the techniques to improve someone.

I have listened to about 400 LRH's lectures and a part probably 4000 pages of other written materials

In these pages I have not found anything about him proposing "satanism" as part of Scientology!!!!

I have found a lot of discoveries about man and how to improve conditions in life.

For me he was a genious and several times I told to myself "how was he able to find that out" . I consider LRH as one of the great men that did something to create a better world.

The majority of the writing of LRH are availlable for everybody and a lot of work is being done to restore all the lectures he has delivered and to translate them in as many languges possible.

FG

Jillanymous [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

FG

I'm wondering how far you have gotten in your OT training. If you had finished OTIII you would have heard of Xenu by now. Its sad that SPs such as ourselves have ready access to this information (and it is true, CoS was forced to reveal it in a court of law during one of their many legal battles).

Also I think one of the main reasons people have a problem with the CoS is its censorship laws and readiness to attack critics. For me its LRH's Fair Game policy that unnerves me the most:

ENEMY SP Order. Fair game. May be deprived of property or injured by
   any means by any Scientologist without any discipline of the
   Scientologist. May be tricked, sued or lied to or destroyed.

LRH:jp L. RON HUBBARD
Copyright (c) 1967 Founder
by L. Ron Hubbard
ALL RIGHTS RESERVED

Eventually Hubbard renamed this as he realized it received bad press.

Scientologists have a history of harassing critics to an extreme life-changing degree, like Paulette Cole for example. If you are uninclined to believe an SP like myself I recommend you to read the wikipedia articles on Operation Freakout and Operation Snow White. While your at it read the articles on Lisa McPherson and Jeremy Perkins too. Then perhaps you'll understand why I'm skeptical to believe that the CoS is trying to help the greater good.

AnOnYmOuS [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

MAny of the commentors know nothing 0F the work of anonymous.
Anonymous is Anyone and everyone united for a common goal.
The current goal of an0nymous is to expose the gross human rights violation and coruption of the "Church of Scientology. We fight for the freedom of spEech. We fight for humanIty.

We are united As oNe divided bY zero
for great justice and lulz//

NonE of uS are as cruel as all of us.

We are anonymous
We are legion
We do not forgive
We do not forget.

We will be heard

Jillanymous [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Our best weapon is knowledge. Spread the word.

We do not forget.

We will be heard.

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG

>I have listened to about 400 LRH's lectures and a part probably 4000 >pages of other written materials

>In these pages I have not found anything about him proposing >"satanism" as part of Scientology!!!!

If you read carefully you will see we never said that, I'll quote myself for you:

Also that statement from "intheknow" about Scientology beeing based on satansim may come from the fact the founder of Scientology, L .Ron Hubbard was indeed in some point of his life an active satanist, he was in the infamous group of Aleistair Crowley.
You can look it up if you don't believe me (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L._Ron_H ...)

As you can see I tried to explain why some people think Scientology is based on satanism wich is probably not right, however the fact remains L. Ron Hubbard was an active satanist in Alasteir Crowleys group.

Dear SCIENTOLOGIST FG ,

If you could revisit '83, and you were told that the founder of the religion you want to join was in fact an active satanist (was) and a pedophile, wouldn't you think twice about joining?
(These are facts, research them yourself if you like, it should be on wikipedia as well)

This is beyond beliefs, you can find something useful in your lectures, you can also find many useful things int he bible the koran and many other religious documents form various religions.
This however matters not, we do not despise your beliefs.
We do not approve of your Church, wich puts pressure on their followers, sues over every tiny bit, sued for tax examption, runs companies, charges money for religion, harresses critics, the list goes on a long way.

For your own well beeing I urge you to leave the church of scientology, there are scientologiest groups wich do offer free lecture and stuff without the pressure and so on, I highly recommend this to you if you feel scientology is the right thing for you.

We are Anonymous.
We are Legion.
We do not forgive.
We do not forget.
Expect us.

Remember the 10th of Februar.

davis m flynn [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

My son joined the S. when he was in early 20's, and when he tried to get out was threatened to be beaten up and received numerous hate mails from their cult is San Luis Obispo. I still have the letters.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]davis m flynn get in touch with an anon who can publicize those documents. Can you scan them into your computer?

Anomyous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

It might be easier to just upload them somewhere and just post a link here. Someone will take care of the rest. Anonymous has a "dispersal network" they can use to distribute the letters

exmormon [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Cool. Can we do the Mormons next? Pleeeeze?

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Anonymous,

I have read thousands of pages of Scientology scriptures.

Who told you that Scientology is a "satan worship religion".

For sure the statement is false.

Scientology believes that a person is a spiritual being and offer tools to improve the individual by increasing his understanding knowledge and responsability.

If you want to have the correct data you need to get the correct source..

The source of Christianity is the Bible.

The source for Muslims is the Coran.

The source for Scientologist is the writings from Ron Hubbard.

"if it is not written it is not true"

Scientologist FG

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG, there are multiple Anons here. I for one have never heard of LRH being an active satanist but what i do know is that the institution of the Church of Scientology is indeed a money laundering cult. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientol ...

Mambo [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

This topic really defines the "20% not Google" part of this site....

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG

Ron L. Hubbard was a criminal- Fact

CoS is a scam and a dangerous money hungry cult. Ron L. Hubbard even said that the fastest way to make money was by starting a religion. That right there should be enough to tell you he only did it for money. Get your facts straight. You're part of a "religion" that brainwashes people. The more money you spend, the more you will soon realize this. They don't tell you about Xenu until you reach a certain rank, I'm not surprised you haven't heard yet. Again, the more money you spend, the more they will tell you.

You know how many cites I've been to where someone said something about the CoS and it was censored? Quite a lot. CoS censoring comments is going against Freedom of Speech. I don't care if it speaks out against their bullshit or whatever. If I want to say the CoS is a crock of shit, I have the freedom to say it. Period. For the CoS to censor that is wrong. You can have your beliefs, by all means, believe what you want. Pick your superstition, kick back, and enjoy yourself. But CoS is a cult whether you want to face it or not, and what they're doing is wrong.

I hope the whole thing collapses and everyone sees Scientology for what it really is- exactly what Ron L. Hubbard was, a fraud.

+ Show video


Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

+ Show video



That is all

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Anon,

False data again.....

LRH never said that to become rich one needs to create a religion.

Someone in a German newspaper attributed this sentence to him.

Also this sentence does not appear in any writing of LRH.

"If it is not written, it is not true".

Ron has given more than 3000 lectures and written thousands of research pages. I don't know if in one of the writings he mentions a "Xenu" but even if does so this "Xenu" is not something that is worshipped in Scientology and in actual fact there are no "gods" worshipped in Scientology.

I have not seen a "Xenu" statue in a church...... :)

So, again you a spreading false data..

But even if there are writing from LRH where he descibes what really happened to this planet in the past maybe that's what happened.....

In any case many religions say that there were external forces "gods... etc" that caused things on Earth....

Lastly... the money.

I don't know of any religion that does not ask for the material support of parishoners.

Some days ago for example my mother received a pamphlet from the catholic church that was asking for contribution to build a home for elderly catholic priests.

The donations that were asked were from $50 to $750,000.

So...why shoud a course be delivered fore free???

A church has expenses: rent, heating, supplies, pay etc.

If a person does not want to do a course he can just stay home and not do any course at all......

Very simple.

A person can also gain a lot of knowledge in Scientology without even spending a dime.... He can go to the local library and read Scientology books. A lot of efforts have being done to get these books into libraries.

I hope, in the future, you will work to hellp those who are building a better world instead of bothering those who are already working to build one.

In Scientology we know that a person is basically good.

I wish you to florish and prosper.

FG

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Update: I'm not sure how new this is but Scientology was also Google Bombed for "brainwashing cult"

see: google.com/search?q=brainwashi ...

Jillanymous [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Just a point of clarification, FG.

Xenu is not a god. We know that you do not worship him. If you'd bothered to do any research on the subject you'd know that. Even if you do worship Xenus, that's not the point. The beliefs of Scientology are not what Anonymous stands against. You should be free to believe whatever you want. If it helps you be a better person, more power to you. Its the censorship and scandal that goes with the Co$ that I'm against. Again, I ask you to look at some of the resources out there before dismissing our concerns. Its up to you to decide what is right for you.

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Jillanimous,
Thanks for the reply.
I don't know if you know the structure of the Church of Scientology and what the functions of the staff are.
In a Church of Scientology there are 9 divisions with a total of with about 30 departments.
These departments deal with training, giving Scientology Counseling, lectures, seminars, selling books, etc etc.
Only one of these depts deals with legal and a part of it acts if there is a an external attach to the church.
The staff have enough work do! and in general they don't deal with external attacks.
So saying that the "church of Scientology" use "censorship and scandal" is a generality as it appears that that is the main focus while it is not.
The main focus is to deliver Scientology services and work to create a better society for all (drug rehabilitation, Voluntair Ministers, education etc etc etc – see the "What is Scientology book -).
If there is an external attack to the church we have to deal with it and we get a product! but that is side activity that just needs to be done.
Scientology is like a fireman that with his truck is moving fast to try to recue someone and the suppressive persons against the church are like some wild animal barking at the wheels.
The fireman has to deal with them but for sure he has more important things to do.
So, if Scientology is not for you. fine. You can follow another religion or none... it is your choice.
But you should not work to harass other people because they follow a religion that is not yours.
There are people that like Scientology all over the world. They like the books, they like the courses they have done, they like the audting (counseling) that they have received, and they like to contribute to the church both materially and by letting other people know about the gains they have had.
That is the reason why Scientology is expanding... because it works.
FG

FG

Anonarama [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Scientologist FG

How much money have you donated (roughly) to the church since you became a member. Please include how much you have spent on tech and auditing also.

Thanks!

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Anonarama,

These are personal data and are not relevant to the subject matter.

The point of this discussion is if it is correct that some "anon" are forwarding lies and false data and than are upset because they are sue for this....

Freedom of speach does not mean freedom to harm with lies.

FG

Tue Abrahamsen [PersonRank 7]

6 years ago #

Freedom of speech means the freedom to express what you believe is the truth – even if it is not the truth to all. And I seriously doubt that Anonymous is lying about their intentions on this matter.

Uh.Non.Uh.Musss [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]SCIENTOLOGIST FG

A few things:

"If it is not written, it is not true"

If this is so, explain why David Miscaviage is the "head" of the church when no missive appointing him was delivered. In fact, to the contrary, LRH appointed (or hatted) Pat Broeker to this position with Pat's wife as second in command. DM took over, cancelled the order (never done before) stating it was a forgery, and sent Pat's wife to the RPF. Please, tell me if I have a MU on this?

Next, issue: of course you don't worship or revere Xenu as a god. Hell, he's responsible for your nasty Body Thetans. Those little buggers are costing you an arm and a leg to get rid of (or in the least, near slave labor). If you haven't reached OT-III, you will not have heard about Xenu...or Xemu.

Next: It is reported (from LRH's son of all people) that LRH was a Satanist who was attempting by way of ritual an "immaculate conception" to bring forth Satan himself to Earth. He believed that extensive drug use was a way to get closer to the dark prince. Later in OT-VII (could be VIII) he likens himself to Lucifer and calls Jesus a pedophile. Also, check Alestair Crowley's x-ed out cross and compare it to the Scientology cross...coincidence?

Funny how you claim that the source of truth in these instances are books written by the man who started the "religion". Find me a book NOT written by LRH or a member of the CoS that speaks about Scientology in a favorable light. I mean, come on, you have to believe that if L Ron were half as smart as you give him credit for being that he wouldn't TELL you or ALLOW you to see and hear these dark secrets. If everyone knew about all the travesties the church is responsible for, there would be no church. The only ones who know everything and are still in it are the ones that stand to profit from the ones that don't. Quit being a pawn. Quit being a "flow" for someone else. Quit sleeping and wake up. If you believe what LRH wrote (which I don't), google the freezoners and release yourself from the prison of lies the church built around you.

Finally, to quote your beloved LRH, "if you want to control people, lie to them". I think that explains your lack of data on these subjects.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

I just wanted to say, this forum member supports anonymous. I'm behind you 100%

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear "Uh.Non.Uh.Musss",

All the policies in Scientology are in written form.

You can check the "Organization Executive Course" in the "volume zero".

So if someone says that the policy regarding something is xyz that needs to be found in the OEC or if it is part of the Technology of Scientology it needs to be part of the "Tech Volumes" or "LRH lectures".

So before spreading around "quotes" you should read "Keeping Scientology Working" policy letter and apply "How to defeat verbal tech".

In this way you will find out that the "quotes" you are referring to LRH were never written by him.

Have you read the books: "What is Scientology?" of the "Fondaments of thought"?

Let me know.

FG

Uh.Non.Uh.Musss [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

[put at-character here]FG SCIENTOLOGIST

You've been well trained. "Always attack, never defend". You skirted everyone of my questions and instead challenged me to read something that really has nothing to do with any of my points. As far as misquoting goes, I give you this:

"Hubbard's last message to his flock, dated five days before his death, was a Flag Order entitled "The Sea Org and the Future." 1 In it he assumed the rank of Admiral, and created the new rank of "Loyal Officer." Pat and Annie Broeker became the First and Second Loyal Officers respectively. Hubbard ended with a cheery message to Sea Org members, speaking of taking Scientology to other planets, and reassuring them that they would be seeing him again."

Pat Broeker was also named as executor of LRH's will and estate.

I'll read whatever you want me to read if you ask what "The Sea Org and the Future" missive contained and why, in an unprecidented turn of events, Dave Miscaviage overturned this missive and assumed control of the Sea Org when Pat Broeker and his wife were named BY HUBBARD IN WRITING as the perverbial heirs to the Scientology throne.

Also, while you're at it, look up or ask around about R2-45. Yeah, sure you'll be told its a joke about an Auditing Process wherin a subject is killed (with a .45) and their spirit is exteriorized. For that, I give you this:

"representatives of the Church of Scientology have publicly acknowledged that "Auditing Process R2-45" refers to "someone being killed and [their spirit] leaving the body"

"On March 6, 1968, Hubbard issued an internal memo titled "RACKET EXPOSED," in which he denounced twelve people (Peter Goodwin, Jim Stathis, Peter Knight, Mrs. Knight, Nora Goodwin, Ron Frost, Margaret Frost, Nina Collingwood, Freda Gaiman, Frank Manley, Mary Ann Taylor and George Wateridge) as "Enemies of mankind, the planet and all life," and ordered that "Any Sea Org member contacting any of them is to use Auditing Process R2-45."[7][8] Former Scientologist Bent Corydon wrote that in late 1967 at Saint Hill, he personally received a copy of an order naming four former Scientologists as enemies and ordering any Sea Org member who encountered them to use R2-45."

Spooky stuff, eh? Why not also dig around on people being ordered to "End Cycle" (commit suicide) in the event they are caught commiting, under direct order, various crimes in the name of the church including murder. The Fishman Affidavit would be a good place to start.

I don't know how long you've been involved but I know you've felt that pang of doubt or uneasiness. You know somethings not right and so have many others before you. They blew and so can you. I invite you to look up some ex-scientologist message boards and just read their stories.

Back to the subject of LRH's writings being the "source" of truth, answer me this: Check some of the older tech against the new tech. Notice anything different? DM and the RTC is squirreling the tech; your tech. Truth is truth, FG, and does not get edited and revised. What happened to the "old" OT levels? Why were they revised? This is not source, FG, and you know it.

I sincerely hope you take a moment to think with what Scientology has negatively labeled the reactive mind. To answer without thinking is exactly that: not thinking. You're regurgitating what's been drilled into your head (very effectively) without taking pause to consider what you're saying and what you've been told. The "reactive mind" is a contemplative mind, a critical mind, a healthy mind. Show some true confront and dig into the things I've given you here. Faith without exploration into said faith is merely brainwash.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Another update: Scientology now longer shows up for "dangerous cult" but it is still number 1 for "brainwashing cult"

Anonymous [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

docs.google.com/View?docid=dcg ...

docs.google.com/View?docid=df4 ...

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Uh.Non.Uh.Musss,

Thanks for the reply.

I don't have, and I don't think you have it either, access to staff posting orders of the Church of Scientology.

They are internal documents and are not part of the "policies" of Scientology. A posting order is just a posting order.

So, anyone can say what they want regarding "internal memos"....

By looking at the general data from anti-scientology comments in the net I have observed that they contain several lies and so I don't trust them as a "source" for what Scientology is.

If I want to know what is the belief of a religion I look for the scriptures of that religion, I read them, I make sure to clarify all the words I don't understand and than I see for myself what data I can use from this body of data.

Regarding the recovery of the tech you should see the event releasing "the basics" ie all the basics books and lectures of Dianetics and Scientology.

You will definitely see that a lot of work has been done to get all LRH data and taking off any typo or addenda from other people.

So definitely RTC is doing an incredible job to get LRH discoveries availlable for all.

If you have an upset you should discover the true cause of it otherwise you will continue to hit the wrong source.

Maybe "the book of case remedies" would be of help.

FG

Tue Abrahamsen [PersonRank 7]

6 years ago #

I really don't think FG is getting the point here. I doubt anybody in this discussion is interested in reading any of the Scientology-scriptures, as the point of this discussion is still not the contents of this pseudo-religion, but rather certain mischievous and mafia-like actions of the church itself.

I doubt any of these actions, of which most try to remove the liberty of free speech from SoC-opponents, are described in the official SoC-texts.

DPic [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

FG is doing it intentionally. Nobody is buying it though.

An0nymoUs [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Scientologists claim that L Ron was a nuclear physicist, a war hero, they claim he was a man of vast skills in many areas. None of the claims are true. The Church of Scientology offers their own version of L Ron's history that every state document and even the college he attended disagrees with.
This so called church uses its tax exempt status to abuse others weak mindedness to their advantage. I like how FG mentions various religious texts the Bible and the Qur'an You should all take notice that you can read any of those for free. SALVATION IS FREE.

The one key tactic that all scientologists will use it to never discuss scientology with the critic.
Though they are all to interested in your lives, your supposed crimes, what religion can you name proactively tries to destroy what they don't believe in?

We are Anonymous
We are the voice of the people
We stand for all that is just
We stand for the meek
We are the protectors of free speech
We are the liberators of thought

We are Anonymous
We are legion
We do not forgive
We do not forget.

We will be heard for the good of mankind.

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear Anons,

As for info this is an article that was published in the italian media.

You, anons, are accusing others of things you are doing.

Anyway, this is the article.....

Rome – We receive and publish in full a press release from the Church of Scientology, which affects the news of these days also its relationship with Internet

STATEMENT BY THE CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY

As has been previously communicated by the Church of Scientology extracts of the statements of Mr. Tom Cruise, stolen and published on the Internet, were part of an official event held in 2004 which was attended by 5,000 faithful of Scientology and other guests.
Those excerpts were selected carefully presented out of context and commented with the intent to ridicule and create controversy.

As there is a right to communicate that there is also not to, especially if what is being transmitted becomes derision and, worse yet, used to discriminate in a way senseless religious community.

Sunday February 10, Scientologists will gather to attend the function Sunday, dedicating a special prayer for those who are fighting for freedom, which it has even lost their lives, and they are remembered today with the Day of Remembrance.

Also on Saturday 9 and Sunday, February 10, those who wish will receive the brochure "The Way of Happiness", an independent founder L. Ron Hubbard, which outlines 21 moral precepts inspired by common sense, to be followed by anyone to create peace and tolerance among men.

Scientologists are proud to be part of a religious movement that is growing and has amply demonstrated the legality and legitimacy of its activities protected by the Italian Constitution.

The community of Scientology in Italy counts more than 10,000 active faithful, many of whom are engaged in voluntary activities among the ranks of associations of civil protection, human rights and the awareness of young people about the dangers of using drugs .

Italian Version ********************

Roma – Riceviamo e pubblichiamo integralmente un comunicato stampa della Chiesa di Scientology, che tocca le notizie di questi giorni che riguardano anche il suo rapporto con Internet

DICHIARAZIONE DELLA CHIESA DI SCIENTOLOGY

Come già comunicato precedentemente dalla Chiesa di Scientology gli estratti delle dichiarazioni del Sig. Tom Cruise, rubati e pubblicati in Internet, erano parte di un evento ufficiale tenutosi nel 2004 al quale parteciparono 5.000 fedeli di Scientology ed altri ospiti.
Quegli estratti sono stati selezionati accuratamente, presentati fuori dal loro contesto e commentati con l'intento di ridicolizzare e creare controversia.

Come esiste il diritto di comunicare esiste anche quello di non farlo, soprattutto se ciò che viene trasmesso diventa oggetto di derisione e, peggio ancora, usato per discriminare in modo insensato una comunità religiosa.

Domenica 10 febbraio, gli scientologist si riuniranno per partecipare alla funzione domenicale, dedicando una preghiera speciale a coloro che lottano per la libertà, che per essa hanno perfino perso la vita, e che vengono ricordati oggi con la Giornata della Memoria.

FG

Ben Allen [PersonRank 10]

6 years ago #

Thanks for your Italian version but, we at Blogoscoped use Google Language Tools.

An0nyMoUs [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

“Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion”

[The Chinese] have neither the foresight or endurance to overrun any white country in any way except by intermarriage. One American marine could stand off a great many yellowmen without much effort.

A Chinaman can not live up to a thing, he always drags it down.

They smell of all the baths they didn’t take.
The trouble with China is, there are too many chinks here. “

“The South African native is probably the one impossible person to train in the entire world; he is probably impossible by any human standard.”

“One of the reasons they [the Japanese] have bad eyesight is probably these microscopic characters [furigana] which have many lines and strokes to them.& We wonder why they went mad and bombed Pearl Harbor when they knew they couldn’t win. That [the Japanese language] would be a reason.”

“He’s [the Arab] been going crazy steadily and gradually ever since he lost the early very fertile basins of the Middle East. He’s been going crazy ever since he failed to learn wheat farming and brought about the erosion of all of the fertile areas of the Middle East.

This race has been going for a very, very long time and has been eating death for a very long time and it is death.”

“The problem of South Africa is different than the world thinks. There is no native problem. The native worker gets more than white workers do in England!

The South African government is not a police state. It’s easier on people than the United States government!”

“Never discuss Scientology with the critic. Just discuss his or her crimes, known and unknown.”

“We are slowly and carefully teaching the unholy a lesson. It is as follows: We are not a law enforcement agency. BUT we will become interested in the crimes of people who seek to stop us. If you oppose scientology we promptly look up – and find and expose – your crimes. If you leave us alone we will leave you alone.

It’s very simple. Even a fool can grasp that.

And don’t underrate our ability to carry it out.”

“And I don’t see that popular measures, self-abnegation and democracy have done anything for Man but push him further into the mud. Currently, popularity endorses degraded novels, self-abnegation has filled the Southeast Asian jungles with stone idols and corpses, and democracy has given us inflation and income tax.”

“Make money. Make more money. Make other people make money.”

All of these are exact quotes from a published journal belonging to L. Ron Hubbard, a man who died a fugative.

We are Anonymous
We are Legion
We do not forgive
We do not forget

We will be heard.

SCIENTOLOGIST FG [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Dear An0nyMoUs,

   “Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion”.

The above is not a quote from LRH.

If you want to quote LRH please write the title and the day of the publication.

Also a quote has to be read in the context otherwise you can chop of a sentence like "take off the typewriter from the table" and than one would think that in Scientology we have to use the typewriter on the floor.... while the full sentence was "take off the typewriter from the table when you dust and then put it back".

Regarding the "we don't forget" I think that Anons have forgot theyr past and they just think that they are a body, a piece of meat, without a believe that man is something more than just matter.

That is the key problem.

If a person believes in the spiritual nature of man he can see that Scientology is doing something to bring up man to a better condition as a spirit.

If a person believes man is just a body than, for him, Scientology and all other religions that believe in man as a spirit are "false religions".

FG

  

An0nym0Us [PersonRank 0]

6 years ago #

Anonymous has no past for it is not a single entity.
Anonymous is anyone who acts under the banner of truth and freespeech.
Anyone who holds these virtues close to their heart and wishes to act without fear of thier life being ruined by the scientology fair game policy is Anonymous.

We have pictures and video of your fair game policy in use during our raids on the 10th of february.

We have expossed the lies of your church regarding our peacful protests. Minutes after the protests began Scientologist websites reported that protestors had turned violent. These are clear lies, the chuch of scientology published photographs from a 2005 protest of which we had no affiliation.

   We criticize no one's religious beliefs as we are all people even your fellow scientologist who can see how corrupt your church has become. We are here to help you ask the questions that your leaders hide the answers to.

Why isn't the tech free?
Why does the church use violent and intrusive means to intimidate their critics?
Why do they hide they're beliefs unless you pay for so many audits?
Why have so many died.
Why have so many lives been ruined.

We are no single person's enemy, for we stand for all of mankind.
We are anonymous
We are a legion of all peoples
We do not forgive injustices against human rights.
We do not forget

We will be heard.

Uh.Non.Uh.Musss [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Ok, needed to chime in again...

FG,

You Said:
"So definitely RTC is doing an incredible job to get LRH discoveries availlable for all" ...

You missed the part at the end" "...as long as they have several hundreds of thousands of dollars"

So, it's obvious that you could care less about the "L Ron is source" issue and the fact that DM is squirreling your tech so, I'll drop it.

You Said:
"You, anons, are accusing others of things you are doing."

Anons exhibit A: Gavino Idda OSA's very own "internet terrorist" who, in the 90's, tried to bring down the newsgroup alt.religion.scientology by hacking user accounts and flooding the forum to disrupt conversation, as well as accessing certain critics accounts and spamming racist hateful messages in ARS and other newsgroups. It's funny that Anonymous was just labelled by the Church as internet terrorists. Don't even get me started on the Regime.

You Said:
"If you want to quote LRH please write the title and the day of the publication. Also a quote has to be read in the context..."

Here in lies the crux of the matter and the timeless argument that most Scientologists can be seen using to discredit critics quotes. We can't post the entire article from which the quote came from or we'll get slammed with more copyright lawsuits than we can shake a stick at. BUT, if we don't we're taking it out of context. Nice position you have yourself in.

BTW, I am reading "the book of case remedies" and guess what? I got it for free. That being said, the book is full of newspeak...ever read 1984? It's by a GOOD science fiction author...not one whos followers bought up all his books to make him seem like an award winning author.

If you'd care to debate some of the "Fondamentals" (btw is this newspeak or is it just a repeated mispelling on your part?) of Scientology, I'd be more than happy to...however you seem content to ramble off a bunch of books I should buy and read that are written by the guy who stood to make the most off of duping people into believing it. I believe I said this earlier, but can you PLEASE point me in the direction of ANY publication that is NOT written by the Church or a member that paints Scientology in a favorable light? I'm begging you...

Uh.Non.Uh.Musss [PersonRank 1]

6 years ago #

Oh yeah, by the way:

A Reader's Digest article of May 1980 quoted Hubbard as saying in the 1940s "Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion."

More info:

Reader's Digest, May 1980
Scientology: Anatomy of a Frightening Cult
by Eugene H. Methvin

To my knowledge and research, this article has never been rescinded and no lawsuit was brought against the publication or the author...seems odd that a sue-happy organization wouldn't have had such a bold statement and article taken down...

This thread is locked as it's old... but you can create a new thread in the forum. 

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