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NYT on Google in China  (View post)

/pd [PersonRank 10]

Thursday, April 20, 2006
16 years ago4,732 views

this article is actually biased towards google.

Most of the IPd filtering is done by the DMZ routers.. which we all now is actually another company. This alos links to our discussions here

http://blogoscoped.com/forum/21749.html

Mysterius [PersonRank 10]

16 years ago #

Hypocrisy? What about Yahoo's claims that it's just doing what any other company would do in its situation? That its ultimately for the best? They're using some arguments similar to Google's, but fooling themselves into thinking that nothing's wrong. Goolge knows what it's doing, and is making sure that they're doing it right.

Philipp Lenssen [PersonRank 10]

16 years ago #

> That its ultimately for the best?

It's at least a possibility Yahoo believes a little evil can be for a greater good. I agree it's unlikely, and it's more likely they just want to strengthen their position in China for better future business opportunities. However, Google explicitly made it a statement to say "don't be evil" ... a claim which may be more powerfull than saying "do some good", because "do no evil" explicitly prohibits you from doing "little evils for a greater good."

/pd [PersonRank 10]

16 years ago #

there washingtonpost has an article by Rebecca.M

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/19/AR2006041902486.html

Annie Gaudreault [PersonRank 0]

16 years ago #

The issue is one of moral respect for the very one thing that Google is all about – freedom of information.

I was shocked to see Google's response to the Chinese. I would not have been surprised to see this kind of behaviour from the Exxon or Enron's of the world, which are simply owned by shareholders greed. But Google??!!

You can rationalize it any way you want. Google sold out, as Yahoo and Microsoft did. We claim that we advocate democracy, but in this case, as it is usually is the test, the actions are much louder than the words.

By accepting the Chineses undemocratic demands, Google simply demonstrates what it is all about. A greed machine.

Shame on you.

Michael Hart [PersonRank 1]

16 years ago #

> However, Google explicitly made it a statement
> to say "don't be evil"... a claim which may be more
> powerfull than saying "do some good", because
> "do no evil" explicitly prohibits you from doing
> "little evils for a greater good."

Is the motto "don't be evil" or "do no evil"? And is there a difference? Maybe I'm splitting hairs, but I don't think Google ever claimed to be God. In fact, they often surprise me with acts of humility and respect for its users (like fighting the DOJ). Maybe we all just want them to be perfect and are disappointed they aren't giving China the finger.

Google says that google.com is still available (uncensored, in Chinese, and not reliable due to China's firewalls). Has anyone confirmed this? And if it is true, what is all the fuss?

Support Freedom! [PersonRank 10]

16 years ago #

Here's a vital point to consider.

Freedom is a very fragile and precious item. It cannot be taken for granted even in the USA and Europe.

Historically, most of humanity has lived under dictators, kings, tyrants, lords, generals, slavemasters, thugs, warlords, emperors, conquerers, etc. Free governments have been the distinct minority. Even today, dictatorships and semi-dictatorships rule a majority of the world's population.

What happens in China will NOT conveniently remain confined to China. The technology being built and refined daily by American technology companies to help enslave the Chinese people can be used anywhere--and it will be so used if we ignore it's threat.

The technology to track every person exists. England is currently integrating all their traffic cameras to keep a 5 year running record of license plates--every time you drive your plate is being recorded. Security, they say. Proposals in the US involve GPS chips to track 24/7 your car. If your cell (mobile) phone is on, you can be found. London may be the leader in "CCTV" cameras watching you, but every city has or will have some.

American made face-scan cameras and digital ID card systems were bought by China so in future Tienanmen Squares, the names of all protesters will just print out in police headquarters for easy pickup and shipment to the organ harvesters.

The US Department of Homeland Security has a request for proposals for RFID tags to be used in ID cards which can be used to pinpoint the location of everyone. The proposal specifies the ability to determine which lane of a road the driver is in, and in a bus, at least 50 tags must be remotely readable.

None of this technology would have stopped 9-11.

A look at the police-state horrors committed in New Orleans after the hurricane shows it CAN happen here:

Instead of arresting looters, police went door-to-door confiscating guns from shop owners, grandmothers and law abiding people defending their homes. Police threatened people crossing a bridge to dry land with being shot, confiscated food and water, and the horrors of the SuperDome are well known. Police even refused to let non-Red Cross volunteers inside the SuperDome to help! Inside the Dome, police just huddled together while people were getting robbed and raped. Police demanded homeowners and shopkeepers abandon safe and dry buildings to the looters. It was a human rights horror at the hands of those who swore an oath "to protect and to defend".

Will future attacks and disasters be used to abolish freedom? Several Presidential Executive Orders already dictate suspending the Constitution and basic freedoms, and allow confiscation of cars and properties, as well as moving people to "relocation camps" and forcing people to work for the government. One new government contract concerns constructing a huge prison camp for 500,000 people--why?

The technology companies have created the tools any government would find essential to enforce a brutal end to freedom should they have (or make) the opportunity.

Will you need a chip in your finger to use an ATM (cash) machine or enter a government building? "Safety and convenience" will be the sales pitch. Until crooks start chopping off people's fingers to use the chip to get your cash.

The next passports will have UNencrypted RFID tags in them. Soon they'll be in everyone's ID cards. Identity theft will simply involve hanging out at crowded places with an RFID scanner, and hacking into the government computers to match up the intercepted numbers with the person's complete dossier.

All in the name of security and convenience.

Before 9-11 this was being resisted. Now, few are resisting and the tools of tyranny are being built quickly--whether to be used in China, England, or your country.

So even those who are unconcerned or unmoved about the use of American (or anybody's) technology to help enslave the Chinese people should fight to the death to stop those same technologies from being used on them, BEFORE it's too late.

The fight of the Chinese for freedom IS our fight too.

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