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Zawodny on Google's Double Standards  (View post)

/pd [PersonRank 10]

Tuesday, May 2, 2006
14 years ago5,242 views

Google is just reminding MS to not use the same tactic that they used to shove IE to users.

no biggie ..!!

Dint [PersonRank 2]

14 years ago #

IE & MSN Search are both from Microsoft, so they are putting their own search application as the default.

FF & Google are not from the same company, which is what makes the difference.

But, I only think it is pure logic that they have put MSN Search as the default tho. I can't image them to put Google (or any other search-app) as the default.

jtdgrz [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

Doesn't Google pay to be Firefox's default search engine? I read that somewhere recently. If that's true, then much of this is completely unfounded...

Chris C. [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

Google's not dumb. They grew to dominate the search market without being IE's default search engine (granted it was a button/sidebar, not a built in search box). They don't need to be the default search engine in IE7 to continue growing. By baiting the blogosphere with these ridiculous comments, though, they keep the conversation about Google at the forefront, reminding people that they will need to change the default search box to use Google.

/pd [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

actually google paid $1B for Dell to make sure search and toolbar was installed a factory OEM setting

Splasho [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

"FF & Google are not from the same company, which is what makes the difference. "
Lets say Google made a GBrowser. Would you complain if they made Google the default search? I wouldn't.

Dint [PersonRank 2]

14 years ago #

Me neither.

But I'm not complaining about MS putting MSN Search as their default in IE either.

Seth Finkelstein [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

Everybody remember: Microsoft is a convicted-in-a-court-of-law monopoly. Rules of conduct are not the same for convicted monopolists.

BioB [PersonRank 0]

14 years ago #

>Lets say Google made a GBrowser. Would you complain if they made >Google the default search? I wouldn't.

I would if GBrowser has MSIE's market share.

Splasho [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

"I would if GBrowser has MSIE's market share."

So whats the threshold you start to complain at? 30%? 50%?

Mysterius [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

I'm not sure what the threshold is, but >80% is definately past it...

Fireheart [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

"Everybody remember: Microsoft is a convicted-in-a-court-of-law monopoly. Rules of conduct are not the same for convicted monopolists."

Well... I dare say Google's de facto monopoly is also dangerous, even though it's got a nicer feeling to it. Or even the more so because of that feeling?

dabomb [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

firefox dosent come bundled with windows that 92% of the world uses, firefox is a third party program that the user CHOOSES to download and it has goog as the start page yes.

Splasho [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

I'm not saying Firefox gives Google as much advantage as IE7 gives MSN. What I'm saying is that this quote is wrong.

"We don't think it's right for Microsoft to just set the default to MSN. We believe users should choose."

If you generalise that:

'We don't think it's right for a browser to have a default search engine. We believe the users should choose'.

But Google doesn't complain that Firefox ships with a default search engine. It is only natural to have a default, not to have one would confuse first time users.

User: "I want to find The Time's website"
User: "Oh look there's a search box"
User:Types "The Times", hits enter
Computer: "This is the first time you've searched, do you want to use: MSN, Google, Yahoo, Alta Vista, dogpile, Ask Jeeves....."
User: "Eek!!"
User: Chooses a random (probably bad) search engine, and probably doesn't find what he wants.

Niraj Sanghvi [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

It depends on how you generalize it...you could just as easily say the statement is generalized to "We don't think it's right for a company to set its brower's default search engine to its own search service" and then the Google/Firefox situation doesn't come into play. That's the problem with generalizing.

However, I don't think that Google is correct in this matter.

Seth Finkelstein [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

This is about what's called "product tying". If a company has a monopoly in one market, and used that monopoly to tie to a product in another market, that can be a violation of anti-trust law.

The difference is that if you use Google, you don't default to FireFox. But if you use Microsoft's IE7, you will automatically default to Microsoft's search – that's "product tying".

Niraj Sanghvi [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

If you use Firefox, you do (automatically) default to Google. It's the default for the search bar as well as the homepage.

Michael White [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

in response to an earlier post, no Google doesn't pay to be the default search engine in FF, though they do pay when a user makes a search from the search box.

Mysterius [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

Why can't IE7 have a list of common search engines that you can choose from the drop-down list, instead of having to go to another web page? Firefox has several choices in the default list, including Yahoo!, though not Microsoft. Though I believe most people will set their own preferences, the process should be made as simple as possible. Then, even if Microsoft set its default, which they are entitled to, users can immediately switch if they want to.

Seth Finkelstein [PersonRank 10]

14 years ago #

If you use Firefox, you default to Google. If you use Google, you DON'T default to Firefox. "Product tying" is when a monopoly uses that power to extend its reach to another product.

901010 [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

Google's basically just being stupid.

Fireheart [PersonRank 1]

14 years ago #

901010: "Google's basically just being stupid."

I disagree... and would say that Chris C. is right that this whole thing is a PR-injection to the media. We shouldn't forget: The main target
group for google are no longer the geeks like in earlier times. They don't need opinion leaders to spread any more. Google IS web search in today's common social reality. At a point were even web-noobs use the term "to google" instead of "to search" they don't have to care if some of their comments might seem ridiculous to connaisseurs. If the majority swallows and is reminded to switch IE's search-box to Google, it's "mission accomplished". The same thing goes for the later post "Marissa Mayer (Video)".

tom [PersonRank 0]

14 years ago #

Micrsoft Target Search Market! Veasible?

arcon5.com/modules.php?name=Ne ...
Micrsoft Target Search Market!

Does anybody actually think Microsoft can become serious competitors to dominating Google?
Because Google is so much easier to use than MSN Search! And every where you look there isn't adverts all over!

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