Yahoo was also asked to hand over details in this case.

Seems to be in line with Gmail's TOS....

I guess ever Email service does this right. I mean if the govts demand them to.

> Seems to be in line with Gmail's TOS....

Yep, though Google in the past decided to fight over at least some subpoenas. These cases remind us that emails are not private when the gov't demands it. There would be a need for stronger privacy laws (or weaker subpoena laws, I guess) to make that more possible.

Well, realistically you have to expect any company to hand over your details if they're handed a legit subpeana. Until I logon to "My Google Lawyer" the sorts of details they provided (date of email, user details) aren't protected.

So far at least, Google seems to have been following this line carefully. Legit subpeana and they obey the law. Spurious one (like the FBI wanting search details earlier this year) they challenge.

... whereas e.g. Yahoo simply hands out everything (even in China).

I agree, Google seems to be walking the fine line pretty well.. if its legit case, I dont see any reason why Google should not hand over my stuff.. but just b'coz some angency wants it ti finger me.. then it becomes a big no no..!!

I think Google learnt their lessons well in china..!!

Hahaha. Thanks for the link, Phil. The commenters on Google Watch are getting a little testy about the "hate speech" angle. I'm trying to figure out today whatever happened to Mr. Ashby. But getting the FBI to call me back is slow going...

One huge reason not to use Gmail and to host your emails on your own server. That's the way it will have to be in the future.

No Alex, even if you have your own server, the law can knock your door down and take your server for forensic's. if you have a hosted service, then the law will get the Service provider to hand over the data...

the way of the future is simple.. dont do stuff that your not supposed to do..!! :)-

<<... whereas e.g. Yahoo simply hands out everything (even in China).
Especially in China.

> dont do stuff that your not supposed to do..!!

... and pray the gov't never deems moral stuff you do *illegal*. Ever so often it happens a gov't decides certain ethnicities, religions, or sexual preferences are illegal... and then the gov't will need to collect data to sort out the good and bad people. Remember the first American "IT" company, IBM? They helped the Nazis a great deal to find Jewish people living in Germany through their Hollerith census machines... and we know what desastrous effects that had. Of course, IBM was "merely" amoral – the direction their "help" took was a symptom of the evilness of many Germans at the time. But it only reminds us that we can't ever be "neutral" if we work together with gov'ts... we make decisions reg. which acts are justifiable to ourselves (or worse, the CEO will simply ignore any kind of justification and try to work wit the evil gov't in secret and *against* the laws, as IBM's Watson did).

"...and pray the gov't never deems moral stuff you do *illegal*."--

Amen!! :)-

You can always put your mail server in Havenco, but that is probably out of most people's price range.

good....
i'm glad google is going this. if you have nothing to hide, you shouldn't worry about using gmail.

gah....
what am i on.

I'm glad google is DOING this

>> dont do stuff that your not supposed to do..!!

> ... and pray the gov't never deems moral stuff you do *illegal*

That's the key issue. Players like Google and Yahoo are the "small fry" in this.

Handing over data in response to a subpoena is not a problem if a government doesn't abuse the process. The problem is, governments inevitably do.

No matter how "pure" a government's actions may seem at the time, when the archives eventually get released (30 years later in the case of the UK) we see that there was systematic abuse of process.

Power always corrupts, and the only way to minimise that is to minimise power that companies or governments hold over individuals.

At least with companies, you can switch to a different company. If Google turns too evil, we'll find someone else. But with a government, most people have no choice.

<< But with a government, most people have no choice.

Governments can be changed in a democracy.

"the way of the future is simple.. dont do stuff that your not supposed to do..!! :)-"

Sorry pd but that sounds like a quite boring way of living :)

Who is the arbitor hate speech at google. I hate google. Submit that lefties

If Google is required to provide information it is a dangerous precedence, because any kind of email kind be considered subversive and dangerous – there is no end to this. The recepient of hate mail can easily block it or delete it. One might wonder whether Google is a private company or a secret organisation which exists for the sake accessing private information from the users of the Internet and passing it on to different governmnent organisations.